This is inspired by Financial Uproar’s post: “God wouldn’t approve of this post.”
He wrote:
Giving away 10% of your income is a pretty poor way to get rich.
It doesn’t matter who you give it to, it’s gone. It can’t be invested for long term growth, or used to pay down debt, or even used to buy food. Getting ahead on 100% of your income is hard enough, cutting it down to 90% is just placing an unnecessary weight upon yourself.
Okay, maybe I’m being too hard on the church.
Maybe they tell people not to tithe if they have debt.
Or, maybe they don’t have to tithe if they’re paying off high interest consumer debt. Or, perhaps the church is lenient on young adults attending school.
No on all three counts.
The church expects 10% of every dollar brought in by every member of the church.
To paraphrase the old George Carlin joke, why does an all knowing and all powerful God need your money? The answer is easy, like every organization, money makes it a whole lot easier to expand your agenda.
TITHING IS GOOD IF YOU CAN AFFORD IT
My grandparents on my mom’s side had 17 children (including my mother) and gave away 10% of their meager income to the church each month.
As a result, my mom and her 16 siblings went hungry for their entire childhood because their parents had no money to feed their kids.
Okay, so my grandparents (more my grandfather) was an irresponsible man to have gotten my grandmother knocked up 17 times with not an extra dime in sight, but they were extremely religious and believed in having as many kids as God would allow them.
When it comes to feeding your children and your family, that’s where I draw the line.
To me, saving at least 10% to pay yourself first so that you can do so, is more important than giving that money away.
As Financial Uproar mentioned above — Getting ahead on 100% of your income is hard enough, cutting it down to 90% is just placing an unnecessary weight upon yourself.
AND THAT GOES FOR CHARITIES TOO
So that you don’t think I’m picking on the church, I feel this way about giving money you cannot afford to give away to anyone/anything/any organization, period.
I wrote a whole post on this about a family in dire financial straits who were still trying to donate money to other families when they couldn’t afford to keep theirs afloat.
Read: Charitable Donations: When it doesn’t make sense to give your money away
THE BEST THING TO DO IS TO BUDGET FOR IT
If you really want to tithe but cannot afford to, then tell yourself that each day you’re working to improve your financial situation.
Make a budget and track your expenses to get out of debt and start saving!
What you should do, is get into a position that allows you to tithe rather than tithing without thinking about how it affects your life.
AS FOR MY SITUATION: I DO DONATE
Although I am now an atheist now (is that any surprise?) it doesn’t mean I’ve had my heart cut out of my body.
I do donate.
I donate 10% of my income each year (when I make money, that is) and sometimes I donate more, like to Japan.
The differences for me are:
- I donate because I want to and am not forced or guilt-tripped into doing it
- I donate because I have already saved for my own future
- I donate because I can afford it
The way I see it, if you can’t afford to take care of your own family, you are just handicapping yourself to be able to donate more money to others in need in the future.
If your family ends up as one of those families you’re helping, it makes everything worse.
So, what do you think?
Just a girl trying to find a balance between being a Shopaholic and a Saver.
I cleared $60,000 in 18 months earning $65,000 gross/year.
Now I am self-employed, and you can read more about 
I was sent a letter from the church I joined last year. The letter asked me to tithe more because the church needs money for a, b & c. I wa also sent a record of the checks I had tithed. I do not always donate by check. Many times I use cash and I do not put my name on the envelope. I am involved in several outreach programs within the church community as well as donating my time to help write calls to worship, proems etc. I am currently undergoing chemotherapy. A few people from the church have called me to ask if there was anything they could do. No one on the church staff who I was working so closely with before chemo has called. I have done many things for the church they don’t know about. I really thought and feel still it’s about the good we do for our community in our everyday lives. How do we relate to one another as a church family? How focused are we on meeting each other’s needs? Now, God is the center of my life as a Christian and Jesus spoke some truth that I try my best to live by as it’s such a healing and worthwhile way of life to me. The Ghandi quote about Christains is one I’ve frquently agreed with and I myself am guilty of not being very Christ
like at all times. I have a sanctuary within and I don’t want that sanctuary to hold any resentments. I’m sure somone has come across this situation and found a way to talk to the elders about how it made them feel. Maybe I just answered my own question. Perhaps I could just tell them, I sit in on session, elder training, I volunteer and I love the joy it brings me. I don’t want to lose that joy because I’ve been told in a handwritten letter I should tithe more. Or maybe I could look at [the letter]as a sign of respect. Everything I read in the Bible about tithing has more to do with the acts of the individual and not just the money. The pastor and staff make several times the amount I make yet don’t tithe 10%. my ( what now seems insignificant) $100 a month is way more than 10%. It’s really not their business for me to defend myself by letting them know this. I gave it because I wanted to help. It’s the same reason I volunteer. I will say it raised a red flag. They are in my will and will inherit quite a bit. But isn’t it the Kingdom of Heaven they want to inherit? Again, my will is not their business…yet, and I hope not anytime soon. I feel like if I told them they are in my will it would be bragging. I’m just a little put off by this and wondered how others’ see this. I am a person who follows the money trail and do not feel anyone is living the ” high life,” at this church. It’s small, community organic garden, hybrid car driving, environmentally responsible, solar powered church who is truly trying and succeeding in making some great changes. There are many truly kind, humble people there who I enjoy growing with so I don’t want this to halt any growth or offend people in the congregation.
Honestly to each his own, its your money so i would not judge you, if you don’t judge me!!!
ForeverYoung got it right. That’s like saying, “Oh, I’ll go to church when I’ve become a better person.” Umm, when will that be? You go TO church to help yourself become a better person! No need to wait. We don’t have much time to sit around and wait for a better opportunity. This may be our better opportunity.
You must give to receive. This opens up the flow of abundance. If
you think “I will give when I have enough money” you actually will never have enough money and you’ll never give.
I’m so glad that you decided to post on this subject. I recently found out that a close family member has been tithing in the neighborhood of $100 per WEEK to her church. This is well over 10% of her income. She is middle class, not wealthy by any stretch, but as it is an inner city church she is one of the more affluent members and so she feels it is her responsibility to give more, as many of their members cannot afford to give at all.
When I asked her how she affords it, she said that she “doesn’t really know how, but it always works out” and that shows her that she’s doing the right thing. No budgeting to figure out how they ACTUALLY make ends meet. Yikes. As a non-religious person, I’m baffled by the situation. I give to charity, but I can’t fathom sending that kind of cash off somewhere without even a budget to make sure it’s actually within my means.
Very interesting discussion! All of us have people in our lives that are ours to take care of. When we have enough to do that and still can share with others, I believe we have the privilege and responsibility to do so. Most of us won’t face a situation where our giving means that we’re not taking care of our own. If it did, though, to “give” would seem negligent and uncompassionate.
I used to donate 5% of my income to charity and I loooooooooooved doing it. It was so awesome to pick out the charities each month. Mostly I donated to the Jane Goodall Institute because I have so much faith in what they do but often I’d also give to other organisations. I recently was laid off and am now working a job I enjoy more but which pays 30% less and at the same time I’d saving building a small emergency fund. But very soon, probably before the end of the year, I will have that emergency fund saved and can begin donating on a regular basis again. I also had the experience that the more I gave, the more I had to give. There is something that happens there that I don’t understand but am grateful for!
I find that when I am willing to give more I end up with more. It’s like the money just flows in when I am willing to be generous. I have talked to many others about this, including some folks who were in dire straights and their experience was the same. It’s kind of crazy how it happens.
One of the things that is rarely discussed is tithing is under the Mosiac Law. Jesus came and fulfilled the law, therefore we are under Grace. In the NEw Testament, Jesus (and then Paul) instructed us to give with our whole heart and to be cheerful about it. It does not say that we are to be bullied or gilted into giving. It makes no sense that the pastor is driving a Mercedes and I’m catching rides to church and while I’m there I’m scraping the bottom of my purse for a tithe because I will be cursed if I don’t. I wish churches, pastors and others would stop telling people they will be cursed if they do not tithe. They also tell you that if you want to be abundantly blessed, then tithe. There is also the confusion about whether to tithe from you gross or net pay. Of course many churches want you tithe off your gross. Do not get me wrong, I am a believer in God, the Son and the Holy Ghost but I also believe that churches has sold this bill of goods as a way to make money. I believe this is especially true in today’s age of the mega church. I agree with the writer of this blog in that each person needs to assess his/her financial situation to determine whether they can give. My heavenly Father still performs miracles everyday and if we believe, we will see the manifestation. My heavenly Father also gave us a mind to process and evaluate and if you don’t have it to give, don’t. Moreover, there are many other ways to give than money like time, skills, knowledge, etc.
P.S. Don’t fall for the okie doke, churches are just as good as Madison Avenue in regards to messaging.
This might sound strange, but your post has actually encouraged me to tithe more faithfully. I realize that I have been holding onto my money thinking that I could provide for myself, when all along it was the Lord who has been providing and will continue to provide. Giving 10% of our income is really a very small thing to give back to our Savior and Creator of the universe.
Oh, I wish I could find this article that I read recently. It was a brilliant discussion on how many non-profits could actually become self-funded – and not through “donations”. It was such a novel concept that it kind of blew my brain. Apparently so far away that my google-fu isn’t working to figure out where I read it.
For me, it kind of depends on how hard my tax bill hits me and what I have coming up in the pipe to pay for. In the years I’ve paid mid-5 figures in taxes, it’s REALLY hard to not think that I’m actually contributing to a lot of government programs that help the needy through my taxes.
My donations don’t approach 10% of my gross or net income. I’m more in line with the average North American of about 2-3% – not including my habits of donating at least one item at the food bank on every grocery shop or giving away everything I declutter to charitable organizations and not trying to sell it for profit.
I had a reader contact me about getting out of debt some time ago. She tithed 10% and couldn’t afford it by any means – not without going further into debt or depriving her children of food. My personal thoughts were to tell her to stop doing it. But I asked a devout Christian friend her opinion and she explained why that wouldn’t be a viable option for this lady in their religion.
When I do attend Mass, I give a couple of dollars. I don’t feel guilted into it or obligated. It’s something I choose to do. When I die, what I have will go to the Catholic Church. This may sound insane to some, but I won’t have any heirs. I am the youngest and I have no children. The Catholic Church does many great things and there were times when I had no money and I was not Catholic at that time and the CC helped me without question of my religion. I just have to say, I really wish you would show more respect to your family. This is just another example of a post where you put your family down. That is incredibly mean and shows a great deal of superiority and insecurity to be judging others, particularly your own family. Shame on you. And don’t give me, the don’t read me speel. I’ve read that before. Learn from your readers instead of telling them off like I’ve seen you do.
When I do attend Mass, I give a couple of dollars. I don’t feel guilted into it or obligated. It’s something I choose to do. When I die, what I have will go to the Catholic Church. This may sound insane to some, but I won’t have any heirs. I am the youngest and I have no children. The Catholic Church does many great things and there were times when I had no money and I was not Catholic at that time and the CC helped me without question of my religion. I just have to say, I really wish you would show more respect to your family. This is just another example of a post where you put your family down. That is incredibly mean and shows a great deal of superiority and insecurity to be judging others, particularly your own family. Shame on you. And don’t give me, the don’t read me speel. I’ve read that before. Learn from your readers instead of telling them off like I’ve seen you do.
Perhaps I’ve just been lucky, but at every church that I have attended more than once or twice, I’ve heard sermons and/or reminders to give what you can give cheerfully, and unless you write a check, no one paid any attention to who was giving what. The church I attended in college didn’t even pass the offering plate through the section where most of us college kids sat, because they knew most of us were surviving on student loans. Most of us volunteered our time, and it always felt like we were appreciated.
My parents’ church recently (well, sort of recently) built a new, larger sanctuary and made other expansions to the church building as the membership was growing so much. They did send letters to members asking for extra donations from anyone who was able, but still encouraged people to donate as they normally did. It was like a separate fundraiser, just like any other non-profit organization might have to build a new building or whatever. I’m not sure how that affected their normal offering collections, but the new building had to get built somehow!
I’m kind of surprised that only one person has pointed out the … morality if you will … of using the resources of an organization (congregation, fellowship, whatever you want to call it) and not “chipping in” a fair share of the costs of running in. No one seems to grudge the dues they pay their gym each month or the tuition they pay their school or the money they pay their homeowners association or whatever other money they’re required to pay to use facilities and services that are provided to them, but make it a church and call it a tithe and all of a sudden people go apesh*t.
If you are going to use the building, learn or be spiritually uplifted or otherwise enriched by the pastor/minister/priest or the music, enjoy the fellowship provided, rely on the support of the church in times of trouble (whether for prayer or more direct support) … then you have a moral obligation to chip in for the service/product you’re receiving. Sadly people wouldn’t do it if it weren’t made a requirement.
And FWIW, I’m not a Christian. I don’t go to church. But if I did, then I would absolutely see myself as obligated to pay some amount towards the upkeep and support of something that I made use of.
Is 10% reasonable – that I think shoudl be a personal decision between the person paying, the people who run their place of worship, and their god(s).
In my Jewish community we call it a membership. We pay dues, not tithes and I think that helps. I know the building needs to be cleaned and maintain and the services and events have costs.We don’t have to go into debt to pay my dues. I’d cut alot of things before I cut that out. Even if we could choose not to pay and still attend the services and events. I’d hate to live in a community where our rabbi was poor. I would feel guilty if I thought his children were going without so he could lead our community. I’m friends with his wife! She invites us for dinner at their home. How could I look her in the eye if I knew she was struggling to balance her budget and feed and clothe her children. Especially when I’m signing up my child for this or that lesson or if I’m buying him nice things to enjoy.
I agree with some of the other comments that tithing in the Old Testament was more of a tax for community needs, done under a religious umbrella because that was their world view.
However, I do believe in the importance of giving with a free heart. There’s a verse in the Bible about testing the Lord and seeing that he will repay you one hundredfold if you give to others. I see it more as a personal test of faith, rather than something that should be “required.”
That being said, I also believe feeding your family is of a higher priority than giving 10% to the church. Definitely an interesting discussion. One I’m sure I don’t have all the answers to. 🙂
I don’t do so out of guilt, and I don’t do so because I naively think the money is making a direct beeline up to God. My church is a place where I go every week to worship and be with others and communicate with God as I understand Him; it’s also a physical building that, like any other building, needs to pay electric, light and water bills. People also go to churches for educational programs or assistance with their own bills or with food, and some of the collection goes in that direction too. I don’t think that anyone would begrudge less than 10% or something that is reasonable for you to give away, and my gut feeling is that neither my church as an independent entity, nor the people running it, nor God as I personally understand him would expect people to give away so much that they could not live.
The idea of tithing when you can’t afford to tithe made me think of Catholic fasting as a parallel kind of example. The point of fasting is penance; the point isn’t to deny yourself food to the point that you make yourself sick, exhausted or dizzy. The Catholic church would rather you eat if you’re suffering, rather than scrupulously following the rules simply because “those are the rules.”
http://www.americancatholic.org/features/lent/faqle9902.asp
I know tithing originated as a religious thing, but I am not a religious person and I ‘tithe’ to organizations that I hold near and dear to my heart. It just feels right to me. I make a very small income for the city I live in (Toronto) because I work for a not-for-profit. But I also eat and have a roof over my head. So if I can lend a hand (or some cash) to the greater good, why not?
And btw – I don’t think your mom’s parents tithing had much to do with their 17 children going hungry throughout their childhoods. Probably more to do with them having 17 children and less to do with them giving to the church.
Ok, this question is coming from someone who hasn’t been to church since I was 5 – I’ve probably been actually inside a church (including weddings) less than 15 times in my 26 years – so if it’s stupid, forgive me. I thought “tithing” meant giving, as in, to any charity. I didn’t realize that “tithing” meant specifically giving back to the church. In this post it sounds like I’ve been misinformed…?
Anyway, I think there are lots of ways to give and giving 10% is probably a stretch for most. I’m also from the US where a lot of stuff (healthcare, college, retirement) isn’t provided for us or at all subsidized by the government, so I also have to worry about saving for/paying for these things. If you can’t give 10%, give what you can reasonably afford and/or volunteer. I think that’s reasonable.
The word is often misused but technically means the 10% (tithe = tenth) you give “back to God”. It’s a biblical mandate. If someone gives less than 10% they’re not tithing, but they’re still giving.
In my opinion, the tithe is one of the most understood ideas in modern Judiasm and Christianity.
In the Old Testament, tithing was more of a taxing system for the Jews. The tithe consisted of a Temple tax, a Land Sabbath Tax and a Profit-Sharing Tax (leaving the corners of your land unharvested for the poor). Rather than the 10% we typically hear today – the Jewish tax/tithe was much closer to 25%.
In the New Testament we don’t see any commands about “tithing” but under the new covenant of Grace – Christians are encouraged to give freely to the poor, those in need, cheerfully, and in a humble quiet manner.
In fact, when you look at the early church in Acts – it actually says the believers gave EVERYTHING away (not just 10%) (Acts 2:44-47).
In fact, I LOVE this letter from Aristides to the Roman Emperor Julian circa 137 AD:
It is the Christians, O Emperor, who have sought and found the truth, for they acknowledge God. They do not keep for themselves the goods entrusted to them. They do not covet what belongs to others. They show love to their neighbors. They do not do to another what they would not wish to have done to themselves. They speak gently to those who oppress them, and in this way they make them friends. It has become their passion to do good to their enemies. They live in the awareness of their smallness. Every one of them who has anything gives ungrudgingly to the one who has nothing. If they see a traveling stranger, they bring him under their roof. They rejoice over him as over a real brother, for they do not call one another brothers after the flesh, but they know they are brothers in the Spirit and in God. If they hear that one of them is imprisoned or oppressed for the sake of Christ, they take care of his needs. If possible they set him free. If anyone among them is poor or comes into want while they themselves have nothing to spare, they fast two or three days for him. In this way they can supply any poor man with the food he needs. This, O Emperor is the rule of life of the Christians, this is their manner of life. — Asistides 137 AD
http://casadeblundell.com/jonathan/the-rule-of-life/
Perhaps, needless to say, if people really believed in a “tithe” they’d be giving a lot more than 10% 😉
Rather than giving 10% to a local congregation – a group of believers have started the “relational tithe” which encourages folks to give to those who are in immediate need – http://www.relationaltithe.com
I’m of religious background and my parents tithed religiously (haha). 10%, even when my Dad would go months without a contract (owned his own trucking company). I have never tithed exactly 10% but I, like you, donate when I can. I think that if you feel you want to tithe, go ahead, but make it an amount you can *comfortably* ‘lose’.
I’m of religious background and my parents tithed religiously (haha). 10%, even when my Dad would go months without a contract (owned his own trucking company). I have never tithed exactly 10% but I, like you, donate when I can. I think that if you feel you want to tithe, go ahead, but make it an amount you can *comfortably* ‘lose’.
I think once we become adults making money, it becomes our responsibility to do our part to help others, be it through giving to charity or through volunteering or whatever. It’s just the right thing to do. That said, how much time or money you give relative to your income is no one’s business but yours. The point is to think about other people, and be compassionate, not to blindly write a cheque to someone else.
Living in Canada a country thaat regularly steps up to help those less fortunate. Our taxes pay for medicare, welfare, disaster relief, old age pensions, all thing the church used to do. We do attend church and we do donate to our parish but, not 10% because we are alreay giving much more that that to support the needs of our community. We also support charities outside the church with our time and money.
I do find it unfortunate that those who can afford to write a big cheque get a tax break but people who donate hours of their time do not.
Weird. I know a Michelle Simpson in real life. I suspect the one I know doesn’t tithe.
Anyway, glad I inspired this post. I feel pretty much the same as you do. If you can afford it, knock yourself out. As I said in my original post, it’s not up to me to tell you what to do with your money. But if you can’t afford it, then maybe you should be donating more time than money. Churches always need volunteers to do stuff.
Hehe. There are, I have found, a lot of me’s around 🙂
I can’t comment on the original post for some reason… but I wanted to say that every time I drive past the mega church with the ginormous video screen billboards on the way to the city I think nasty thoughts about tithing. Especially since the people I know who do it are in debt, have no savings, and are making like 30K/year or less as a family. (The government is subsidizing their tithing because they’re not paying taxes!) Then there’s all that tithing money being spent on ads to keep gay people from getting married… I’m on board with feeding and clothing the poor, but not money spent on hate.
For a long time we had a deliberately controversial post started on the topic, but eventually I decided it was *too* deliberately controversial, so it’s sitting unfinished in the trash.
I’m all for giving money to charity, but not at the expense of debt (especially personal loans) or feeding, clothing, and sheltering your own family. Take care of real people first. Then you can give money to more inefficient bureaucratic organizations.
Oh the Mega church. I shall keep those thoughts to myself.
Anyone who tithes out of guilt is not tithing, they’re living up to people expectations. Of course everyone should meet their own immediate needs, but no man is an island. I strongly believe everyone feels a sense of connection and responsibility to their community and tithing is one way that we help our community. I’m sure your mothers family had it tough but who knows how many times they may have benefited from assistance received from their community, from their church?
As a practicing Christian, I gladly tithe 10% of my pretax salary because I want to. I was trying to think of something that would tick all the politically correct boxes but the fact of the matter is, I feel a sense of connection to my community. I know my church endeavors to meet the needs of my community- financial and otherwise – so if I can do my part by donating my time, effort and money, I gladly will. Granted, I guess on paper you can say I can afford to tithe money but even the poor among us can tithe their gifts, talents, effort for the Lord, he sees and knows our hearts intent and that’s what it all about, sacrificing self for the greater good of our own community.
I’m a Christian and I tithe. Really, those statements should be synonymous but they aren’t always. I don’t tithe because I “feel obligated” but because the Lord of the universe tells me to give my first 10% back to the One who owns it all in the first place.
I have never gone hungry when I tithed. The only time I’ve been that broke ($10 for 2 weeks of food, anyone?) was in college when I thought I couldn’t afford to tithe. Looking back, I bet tithing (aka having my priorities in the right order) would have fixed many of the other things– financial and otherwise– that were messed up in my life at the time.
I tithe 10% of my [pre-tax] income because it’s the right thing to do, and honestly even if it meant going hungry I’d keep doing it (I did it during year-long unemployment in 2009). God doesn’t promise me a middle class home or a savings account, but He will supply my needs. 10% is a piteously small offering to the God who puts air in my lungs every day!
I’m working on my budget for this next school year, and I had almost talked myself out of tithing before I read your comment. It’s easy to talk about God’s faithfulness, but not so easy to budget for it :). I’m cutting down on entertainment, clothes & toiletries to get my 10%. Thanks you!
I don’t get why it is supposed to be pre-tax. I don’t really earn my pre-tax income. I can’t use my pre-tax income to decide if I’m can afford a new car or a wii. Why should I be donating ten percent based on a figure that isn’t in line with what I have in my pocket?
I don’t think there’s necessarily a right or wrong answer to pre- or post-tax; I think it’s something one should pray about. I just have decided to do pre- because if I give 10% of the post-tax amount the government is getting my “firstfruits”, not God.
This is soo weird but I had a post about this in mind for later this week!
I can imagine scenarios where tithing could help improve a person’s financial situation if it was a starting point for a new direction in handling their finances, but certainly not where the money is so tight it needs to go to food.
If you are so involved with a church that tithing is an obligation, surely you’d be receiving something pretty important from that church? Emotional support, fellowship, entertainment, it might be money well spent versus counselling, going out to expensive places, shopping for fun, and so on?? Not sure as I am never likely to join a church LOL But I can see the potential for it being a rational economic choice as well as an emotional/spiritual one. very much agree your first responsibility is to meeting the needs of the people you are responsible for!
In titheing’s defense…As a Christian, yes, in some ways, I feel obligated to tithe. The point of tithing is not to do so out of obligation, but to give from the heart, in faith, that God will provide. Time and again, I see that money I have tithed come back to me. Sure, I could hoard it and throw it all toward savings, but I get a satisfaction out of seeing what God can do. and how the money is often returned to me, whether through unexpected bonuses, etc.
I also give above the 10% to other needs and regularly support another family doing mission work.
This probably makes no sense to you and may seem foolish, but I give because I do see an investment – in lives being changed around me and around the world.